My Response To Calvary Chapel’s Pastor’s Perspective Program on The Whosoever Movement

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Inside the KWVE Studios Friday November 21, 2014. Interview with Ryan Ries of the Whosoevers on Pastors Perspective

For months now I have been wanting to hear what Pastor Brian Brodersen’s thoughts were on what I have seen happening in the Whosoever movement.

As I shared in my last post “Calvary Chapel and the Whosoevers–Is The Church Tolerating The Sin of Balaam and Jezebel,” over the last few months I have been calling and emailing Pastor Brian repeatedly. I was hoping and praying to hear back from him. I honestly thought that maybe he didn’t understand what was going on with things inside the movement. I thought he would at the very least be interested, even concerned. I know I am not the only one that cares about these issues. I see people on Facebook, everyday, asking the same questions and hoping for the same answers.

So when I received a phone call on Friday afternoon that Brian Brodersen was addressing the Whosoever movement on Pastor’s Perspective I was thrilled. If you are not familiar with Calvary Chapels, Pastor’s Perspective is a radio program where you can call in live and ask questions. Well, on Friday November 14 the whole show was dedicated to the issues many people are seeing with the Whosoevers.

Finally, a response! I could finally hear what Pastor Brian thinks of all of this!

Honestly, it was good to hear something come out of his mouth. He is the senior pastor of one of the largest Bible teaching church fellowships in the United States. But what I heard was not only disappointing, it was shocking.

It knocked the wind out of me.

I sat in my car, in a random parking lot that I had pulled into to listen for an hour, and cried. As the concerns of many loving Christians were minimized, marginalized and vilified.

But this isn’t about me. I am not here to defend myself or what I wrote. I do still stand by it. I have prayed to the Lord to help me write this. Because first and foremost I need to have a spirit of humility. I am nobody. I am not here to win an argument. Pastor Brian is smarter than I am, and he has accomplished more in his life than I have. He wins.

However, I want to respond. This is not written to correct Pastor Brian. He has taken his stand. But, I am writing this to those who have emailed me asking me what I think of the show.

Since I am getting emails asking for my response, I am going to respond to a few key points. I am going to paraphrase some of the comments as best as I can. Please feel free to listen to the show to get exact word for word quotations.

“Raw Language”

First of all, at the beginning of the show they ask Ryan why there is “raw language” on his website. They must be referring to the youtube video of the KORN concert that the Whosoevers posted on their website, where you could hear the F-word over and over and over and over again. This video has since been removed.

Ryan responded by saying that they want to show the good, the bad, and the ugly of Christianity. That our generation wants raw truth. They want you to be straight up, to talk about sex addiction, suicide, cutting, etc. He said that Nikki Minaj’s album cover is pornographic and every kid sees it and is exposed to this stuff.

My question is- What? So, wait? What is your answer to that question? Because who told you that you shouldn’t talk to kids honestly about sex addiction, suicide and cutting? Nobody has ever criticized you for that! The question is, why does your Christian website have the F-word on it? Why do members of the Whosoevers use foul language and unwholesome words? Is that a prerequisite for reaching the youth? Why do you act like the only way to reach out to troubled youth is offensive language? Oh wait, you don’t call it offensive language you call it “raw language.” Why does that make it more real? Phrases like “butt naked wrestling” and “banging girls” do not belong in the pulpit Ryan. Standing in your father’s pulpit on a Sunday morning and saying, “Let me lay hands on you and pray for you” while you reach your hands out as if you are grabbing a girls breasts, laughing, and then saying “don’t do that when you pray for girls” is irreverent to the Lord. Not only that it makes women feel uncomfortable, and disrespected. You say that you care about these troubled youth, so consider how that might make a troubled young victim of sexual abuse feel–very uncomfortable.

How about the “raw language” that Head uses, in the video from Denver that you are using to justify that God is doing amazing things on the tour? You posted a video on your Facebook (below) and you are proud of the ministry that took place there. But what about the “raw language” that came out of Head’s mouth as he “shared Christ“– “Oingo Boingo, Duran Duran BS,” “Meth grabbed me by the b@lls,” “That religion that we saw on TV when we were growing up . . . most of it was BS!” or how about when he began his prayer at the end, “Lord, Look . . . There has been a bunch of BS sold to us Lord . . .”

Irreverent and ungodly.

So people put their thumbs up in the air, to respond to a positive message. How many of them do you honestly think just got saved? How many of them just picked up the cross? How many of those people are convicted of sin and repentant? How many are going to get in their cars and throw out their Korn and Slipknot CDs? How many of them are really going to go and listen to the Shine Bible studies after they were just told by Head, that all that church stuff they saw on TV as kids is “BS.” It was an easy message, and you got a positive response. On top of all of it, it was a message filled with anger at traditional Christianity and filthy language.

Dear brothers and sisters, not many of you should become teachers in the church, for we who teach will be judged more strictly.  Indeed, we all make many mistakes. For if we could control our tongues, we would be perfect and could also control ourselves in every other way . . .And so blessing and cursing come pouring out of the same mouth. Surely, my brothers and sisters, this is not right!  Does a spring of water bubble out with both fresh water and bitter water?  Does a fig tree produce olives, or a grapevine produce figs? No, and you can’t draw fresh water from a salty spring.” (James 3:1-2, 10-12)

I don’t see a verse underneath that qualifies that “raw language” is okay if the times are wild and you need to be relevant to the culture you are trying to reach.

Has Brian Welch Matured?

The second thing that I want to address is the question that was asked, “Has Brian Welch matured?” Ryan replies, “Totally.” It was in reference to the videos online. Probably Whosoevers Exposed.  They went on to say that yes he has matured and that the videos online are from 10 years ago, and they are old and irrelevant. Which isn’t exactly true . . . Since the older videos show him a bit more godly than the newer ones . . .

Ryan made a bold statement, “God led him back to Korn. Those are his best friends he grew up with his whole life.” He says that Brian is able to show them love, and share Christ with them. I find this statement presumptuous.

He is saying that God led Head back to Korn, and he is expecting that statement to settle any questions critics might have. Well, is God leading Head other places? Did God lead Head to the Benny Hinn event? Did God lead Head to Bethel Redding? Did God lead Head to the occult Supernatural Bible School (last month)? If God is leading Head, then why would there be so many strange places Head is going?

Brian Brodersen followed with, “When your walk is solid we need to be able to go pretty much any place. Jesus wasn’t afraid to go anywhere.”

This sounds good, but this just isn’t true.

First of all, you can’t just go anywhere. You can’t just go to a strip club, sit down and share Jesus with a girl that is dancing for you, just because your walk is solid. You can’t go watch 50 Shades of Grey with a bunch of lonely dissatisfied women, just so you can witness to them about purity afterwards.

Second of all, this whole statement is predicated on the idea that Brian Welch has a solid walk. Which has not been demonstrated at all, and is exactly what is being brought into question!

Before we even go on to talk about him playing in Korn, or touring with Slipknot. Why don’t we look at his supposedly “Christian” work? This song “Flush” is one of his videos that he did 3 years after leaving Korn to follow Jesus. It is about how addictive and destructive an addiction to meth can be. I would suggest you DON’T watch this video, because it features two women in bras and underwear licking red powder off each others half naked bodies rubbing their chests, engaging in lesbian behavior and it is extremely erotic and distasteful. Again, this is his work as a “Christian.” But don’t watch it, unless, like Brian Brodersen says your walk is solid–because then, we can by all means tempt ourselves into sexual immorality.

Like seriously though, don’t watch this:

Click here if you don’t believe me, and you want to see the video “Flush”

[I removed the embedded video because the image was too gross]

Head says that this song is about “flushing all the crap in life down the toilet and starting out fresh.” I guess lesbian erotica helps you do that? 

Pastor Brian went on to share a truly endearing story of Head ministering to his sister in a very sweet and compassionate way. He was blessed.

He said that because of this incident, when people come up to him with information like I presented in my article, he shrugs his shoulders and says, “I don’t have time for this . . . When was the last time you led anyone to Christ?” Then he laughed, and went on, “You been telling any heroin addicts about Jesus lately?”

This sounds like he basically makes negative assumptions and scoffs at the very watchmen that are trying to contend for the faith. Instead of being willing to address the difficulties and edify the church; it is like Brian Welch is above error, just because one time he had a good conversation with Pastor Brian’s sister.

He goes on to say in his soft thoughtful voice, “Often times, the ones criticizing the loudest are the ones who really aren’t doing anything, except sitting around criticizing the ones who are out doing it.”

Wow. Basically, he is saying that as believers we need to “be quiet” about all this. Because if you voice a concern, it means that you are failing at serving God. That is very subtle manipulation. And it isn’t even true! You don’t even know me, or the people making the videos or the other writers. You don’t know that I couldn’t even write this response until today because I was involved in actually serving God this weekend! But that doesn’t matter. Because even if I wasn’t serving God this weekend–this argument is a logical fallacy! Brian Brodersen is smart too, so he even knows what Ad Hominem means.

And, I must say that I get this response a lot. Especially from the Whosoever crowd. And it is a tactic of bullying. Instead of assailing me with assumptions, why don’t you just use a Bible verse and show me where I am wrong? That works much better. And it is Biblical.

But Ryan says, “Head and Sonny are the real deal. True Christians, true love, leading thousands of people to the Lord.” He then goes on to make a /prophetic/ declaration I guess that when we get to heaven we are all going to see who gets all the crowns, it won’t be the criticizers. Anyone who criticizes the movement will stand and watch as Jesus gives all the crowns to Head and Fieldy.

Perfect Theology?

The interview goes on, and this will be the third thing that I feel needs to be addressed. Ken Sutton asks Ryan this question, “Sonny and Head, these guys don’t have perfect theology do they?” *pause* Ryan repeats, “…perfect theology…” soft laughter fills the studio. As everyone chuckles at the idea that anyone has perfect theology.

Sutton explains, “this is the nuances: they have said this . . . they have done that . . . gone to this church . . . they don’t have perfect theology do they?”

So Ryan goes on to explain why this is understandable. “When you are a rock star you meet everyone . . . you meet all the freaks.”

He shared a story of a time when Head sent him a picture, and he asked where he was and found out that  Head was at a Benny Hinn event. At this point in the conversation, everyone laughed again (the laughter was weird to me throughout this whole interview). And Ryan said he texted him, “You’re a weirdo, dude.” And they laughed again (is this really funny?) Apparently the reason that Head finds himself at Benny Hinn events, in the Holy Ghost movie, serving communion and toking “baby Jesus” with John Crowder, rolling on the ground “drunk in the Spirit” at Bethel Redding, and recently graduating from Jonathan Welton’s Supernatural Bible School, is because he is just a people watcher. Ryan said,  “He’s not backing those dudes.” Head just wants to check out everything.

Now these are lies. This is simply not true. People will hear this on the radio, and believe that it is true. But it is a lie. And I cannot say that in a nicer way. This is not old news; it isn’t that he used to be into all this stuff, but he is not anymore. No. This is what he is into, he is proud of it, and he isn’t going to change. He has said so. Recently.

Question online

It sounds like now he knows better, But it is the irony of the non-response because they are not saying that he no longer supports Crowder, just that he is now aware.

And since when does Calvary Chapel laugh at the question of bad theology?

Is that a new thing?

When Pastor Chuck died, did we then get free reign to read The Shack? 

And so why did you pull Gungor off the radio list Brian? (insert soft laughter). If it doesn’t matter if they have perfect theology or not?

In fact, I saw someone ask Ryan if he had warned Brian Welch about John Crowder. And Ryan responded yes, that he is aware. They are acting as if Brian has been warned and repented of his ungodly connections. It couldn’t be further from the truth! (If you don’t know who John Crowder is, why he is demonic, and how Brian is connected to him, click here and scroll down).

This person makes a good point. Head has not renounced false teachers, he continues to promote them.

This person makes a good point. Head has not renounced false teachers, he continues to promote them.

In fact three months ago, Brian Welch asked people to donate money to a ministry that supports John Crowder.

In fact three months ago, Brian Welch asked people to donate money to a ministry that supports John Crowder.

john crowder book

The Fire House Project, that Head asked Christians to give money to recommends a book by John Crowder. They are super mystical, and their doctrine is dangerous.

Brian Welch teaches us to get drunk in the Spirit as he rolls around on the floor, telling us that God loves us like a man loves his wife’s naked body. It is so strange. (March 2014)

He asks people to pray for an experience with God, “Say it with me, ‘Jesus. I don’t know what this is all about. But I know Head wouldn’t lie to me. Show me that these angels are real. Show me that your spirit is real. Show me that you are really God. I want to know the truth. Show me the way. Amen.'”

Wow. But I know Head wouldn’t lie to me? Show me these angels are real? Is that the gospel?

Too Worldly?

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Ryan posted this on his Facebook with the caption “Are the Whosoevers devil worshipers? The Whosoevers exposed.” You can see how seriously he takes these allegations.

The next thing that I want to talk about is the discussion on worldliness. They began to address the critics who say that the movement is too worldly.

Ryan addressed this by saying you need to be in the world, and not of it. Okay. He went on to say, “you gotta be in the world if you are going to reach people.”

I agree. But I disagree that it means it is okay to be worldly to reach people. He uses the example of Jesus taking the disciples to Caesarea Philippi, this is a place where they used to worship Pan, and it was worldly, and demonic and people were even sacrificed there. Except. Jesus didn’t take them to a pagan festival. He took them there because he was about to take three of them up Mt. Hermon and be transfigured before their eyes. You can’t just take this portion of Scripture and act like this was Jesus taking them to a Korn show, being a light in darkness.

Brian Brodersen goes on to say, “Do not judge according to appearance. Judge what is right according to truth. I have the advantage of knowing you Ryan. I know you, I know your heart, I know your story, I know your love for Christ, so I completely trust you. When I hear you are on tour with Slipknot (everyone laughs) what was that tour called? (Ryan says, ‘Prepare for Hell’ and everyone laughs again) Yeah, when I see that I’m not worried thinking gosh I hope Ryan doesn’t jump in there . . . because I know you. People who don’t really know, they are looking from appearance and making a judgement call. I think if people knew Head. If you knew Sonny. If you knew they were in the trenches . . . I think one of the mistakes is to think as Christians we are to isolate ourselves . . .”

Pastor Brian please stop worrying about what the critics think, and please start worrying about what the new believers think!

Because, there are many people that are making a judgment about this. The least of all is me. I am honestly not at all stumbled into sin by this. I came out of this lifestyle and I hate it and I am not at all looking at this and thinking, “Hmmm. Maybe it is okay for me to listen to Slipknot again?”

But there are those who are thinking that. They are looking at this ministry, and seeing head post pictures from backstage at the Slipknot shows and judging that they can have that life and walk with Christ.

Don’t worry about what I think about this.

Worry about what THOSE people think.

A woman posted on the Pastors Perspective Facebook page this weekend:

Pastors’ Perspective – Brian Welch joins this video around the 9 or 10 minute mark. This is NOT a 10yr old video – this is from 1 yr ago. Warning – the whole video is completely foul and evil. Who is getting the glory here? Certainly not Jesus. While you pastors had Ryan Ries sitting in front of you in the studio, you should have given him godly/pastorly advice to walk away from this darkness. Instead, you promoted it. Shame. Ryan says he had a porn problem. Have you seen the mic stand that Korn uses? It’s a naked woman’s body. As pastors, shouldn’t you be advising Ryan to walk away from that, too? Your program was not honest and was just a promo for The Whosoevers. Where are the testimonies of young people walking away from this darkness? Not going to happen because they are actually being invited to join it! I am very disappointed in the leadership of the church that we have been a part of for 30 years. Stop pretending that this ministry is actually doing anything. It is only indulging sinfulness. Korn and Slipknot lyrics and images are evil and there is no way Ryan Ries should be on tour with them. I cannot even believe that Brian Brodersen said that God called Brian Welch back into Korn. Have you lost your mind?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Az9vNcW7Cc

Pastor Brian and Pastors Perspective, both, did not respond to her. 

The link she posted shows Head performing with Rob Zombie (who I used to love). It is so hard to watch this and wonder how a believer could 1.) think this is okay and 2.) not get their heart sucked back into the the worldly love of it.

Pastor Brian says worldliness is about our hearts, but how can you say Head’s heart is not into Korn’s music? That isn’t true. He loves it. He admits it. In the video posted above, you see Head performing “Am I Evil” with these bands.

So you can’t tell me that people are not going to be stumbled back into worldliness thinking that they can have both–satanic music and worship, Slipknot, J-Devil and Christ, darkness and light–when the Whosoevers certainly are having both.

THAT should matter to you Pastor Brian.

THAT is righteous judgment.

“Abstain from all appearance of evil.” (1 Thessalonians 5:22)

Why? So you don’t stumble others!

When I was in a dating relationship, I was taught by Calvary Chapels that I shouldn’t be seen snuggling in a car with my love interest, because of the appearance of evil. We shouldn’t be alone at my house late at night, because of the appearance of evil. We shouldn’t go on vacation together before we are married, because of the appearance of evil.

Chuck Smith never said that it is okay to go on vacation getaways with my love interest if he knows us. Other people might think we are fornicating . . . but that is just because they do not know us. But Pastor Chuck knows our hearts . . . And when was the last time they shared with a heroin addict? But really, it is fine! He knows our hearts, and our love for Jesus, etc. People are just being judgmental and legalistic. NOPE. 

Pastor Brian knows their hearts.

“The heart is deceitful above all things,
And desperately wicked;
Who can know it?” (Jeremiah 17:9)

Where are the Whosoevers being careful to ABSTAIN from ALL APPEARANCE of EVIL?

This is not even mentioned.

It is just dismissed with, “well, you don’t know them well enough.”

At one point they even said that Slipknot is probably just putting on an evil facade. It is just a show. So they are giving the idea that these guys are really not that bad, it is just a show. They just like to put on the appearance of evil, for fun. They are sheep in wolves clothing, really. Well, maybe goats clothing would be more appropriate.

Cool. Anyone have the gift of discerning of spirits? If so, see how far you can get in this song without feeling something literally demonic. Go ahead and pray over your home afterwards too, to close the door you just opened.

Then it gets really ridiculous.

It Is Just a Job

After Pastor Brian discusses Christians isolating themselves, he talks about this idea that if you are a Christian musician people think you need to be in a Christian band or on a Christian label and that people think you are bad if you aren’t. He says, “That’s a wrong thing. We would never apply that anywhere else. If I’m a carpenter I don’t have to work with a Christian contractor.” He says it is the same with a mechanic, and so on. He says, “If I’m a musician, this is my job. I want to be a witness. I look at Sonny and Head, and that’s what they’re doing.”

Well, there is a huge difference between working as a carpenter (which is a job that Jesus did) and playing in a satanic band. Right? There is a difference between being a mechanic and a stripper. Right? There are certain jobs you need to resign from when you choose to pick up a cross. If your job causes you to sin against God you need to quit.

Playing music in Korn is a sin. The songs are blasphemous, pornographic, and R-rated. We are not talking about playing back up for Stevie Wonder.

Christians can’t even listen to Korn without sinning. Period. And now that line has been blurred.

Brian Welch performed this song about a year ago. It probably has over 300 F-words. It looks like Brian is having a good time too. Brian needs to repent.

So now you have people singing worship songs at Shine, and singing Korn songs in the car on the way home from church. Interesting.

Brian said that with the “Coorperate America Anti-Christ Agenda” who can you work for? Basically implying that working for Target and Starbucks is equally Anti-Christ. So here we have again another logical fallacy Pastor Brian–False Comparison.  A carpenter is not the same type of job as a guitarist in Korn.

And to imply that the critics think it is wrong to work a secular job, and we just hide in our houses, isolating ourselves, with our “Christian yellow pages” is again, another insult, based on assumption, intended to silence the critics.

John the Baptist

I am almost done with this response. What I say isn’t going to change anything anyways. But I do want to point out something. Ryan mentioned that people at Knotfest came up to his booth saying, “there were Christians outside telling us we were going to go to hell and we need to repent.” He said that it was turn or burn, and unloving. He said that the Slipknot fans said that they liked the Whosoevers better, because they are all love.

Woe to you when all men speak well of you,
    For so did their fathers to the false prophets.” (Luke 6:26)

Just sayin.

He said, “99% of all Christians won’t walk in there because they are terrified of the place because it is dark.” and he finished with comparing the Whosoever presence there to the ministry of John the Baptist.

If you were preaching like John the Baptist Ryan, the Slipknot fans would not have loved you or welcomed you at all. Be honest.

John the Baptist preached, “Repent of your sins and turn to God, for the Kingdom of Heaven is near.”

“You brood of snakes!” he exclaimed. “Who warned you to flee God’s coming wrath?  Prove by the way you live that you have repented of your sins and turned to God.  Don’t just say to each other, ‘We’re safe, for we are descendants of Abraham [or maybe some other man of God].’ That means nothing, for I tell you, God can create children of Abraham from these very stones.  Even now the ax of God’s judgment is poised, ready to sever the roots of the trees. Yes, every tree that does not produce good fruit will be chopped down and thrown into the fire.

 “I baptize with water those who repent of their sins and turn to God. But someone is coming soon who is greater than I am—so much greater that I’m not worthy even to be his slave and carry his sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire. He is ready to separate the chaff from the wheat with his winnowing fork. Then he will clean up the threshing area, gathering the wheat into his barn but burning the chaff with never-ending fire.” (Matthew 3)

John the Baptist did not set up a tent at a pagan festival to sell t-shirts and hand out CD’s of his testimony. He preached a hard message.

He literally preached turn or burn.

Didn’t you say that was a bad thing to do?

What is funny is that you laugh at Benny Hinn (a fake teacher who lies and steals from God’s people). You excuse all of Head’s ministry connections that have “imperfect theology.” All those false teachers get a free pass and a soft laugh. The ONLY ministry you come against are the ones who preached the gospel to the people going to Knotfest. Why? They had the word of God coming out of their mouth and they were speaking truth. People actually stood there and repented. Are they not on the same team you are playing for?

I am reminded of what Jesus said in John 15

“If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. The world would love you as one of its own if you belonged to it, but you are no longer part of the world. I chose you to come out of the world, so it hates you. Do you remember what I told you? ‘A slave is not greater than the master.’ Since they persecuted me, naturally they will persecute you. And if they had listened to me, they would listen to you.  They will do all this to you because of me, for they have rejected the one who sent me.”

Now I am not saying we need to be mean to people, at all. We shouldn’t. But those people outside were not being mean. They were preaching. Preaching like John the Baptist. Outside the gates. Maybe most of the Slipknot fans did not appreciate their message because they love darkness rather than light. And maybe, they don’t mind your message so much because it doesn’t convict them of sin.

“And the judgment is based on this fact: God’s light came into the world, but people loved the darkness more than the light, for their actions were evil.  All who do evil hate the light and refuse to go near it for fear their sins will be exposed. But those who do what is right come to the light so others can see that they are doing what God wants.” (John 3:19-21)

Knotfest 2014


Final Thoughts

So in conclusion, I finally have my response from Pastor Brian. He said it at the beginning of the program:

“We are really happy that you are here. Really blessed that you are doing Thursday nights with Shine. We just want to continue to pray for you. And man, when I hear about you preaching at Slipknot concerts I just think that is absolutely amazing.”

It isn’t what I wanted to hear, but at least now I know where Calvary Chapels are choosing to stand, what they are willing to overlook and ignore, and who they are choosing to insult.

It is a little shocking. It is very sad.

I am grieving, literally crying over what is happening. Ryan assumes that people like me are critical because we don’t get it. The opposite is true. I get it. I am critical because I was in it. I came out of it. I see the demons behind it. And I don’t see people getting rescued, but false converts putting their thumbs up to a positive message, thinking they are saved, and walking away unregenerated.

I am so broken.

But I am still praying.

I still love the people of Calvary Chapel. Of course. I am fervent in prayer for them to see the truth. They will hear the good stuff from the Whosoevers movement. They will hear rational explanations, soft laughter, and Biblical sounding encouragement from Ryan. In fact the show ended with him giving a pot addict a very good message of repentance. They will see Pastor Brian Brodersen support them no matter what, and “not have time” for any serious information.

Good people will be confused because after all, how can it be bad when Ryan says some really good things. They forget that the enemy uses a LOT of truth to conceal a tiny error. Like Jacob Prasch says, “Every mouse trap, has real cheese.”

But please don’t forget that even a little leaven will spread, and leaven the whole lump.

Please don’t tolerate leaven in your life.

Please don’t compromise with leaven in your church.

In the end, you are really going to have to look at the facts for yourself, and line them up according to the Word of God. Please don’t blindly follow what I am saying. And don’t just follow what Pastor Brian says, just because he is smart and successful. It doesn’t matter. We are all accountable for what we know. We all have to look to the Word of God, and not the smooth words of man, in order to discern truth from error.

I am praying for everyone who sees this. God bless you.

For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,  teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age,  looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works. Speak these things, exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no one despise you. (Titus 2:11-15)

You can’t argue with that verse, even if you softly laugh in a radio studio.

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61 Responses to My Response To Calvary Chapel’s Pastor’s Perspective Program on The Whosoever Movement

  1. Ballerina says:

    Am kinda leery commenting your blog again. Last entry you posted, my response resulted in 2 nasty emails to my website, telling me that I was “too judgmental” towards CC. I make no apologies, for the simple fact that Mathew 24:11 is clear that many false prophets will arise and deceive many. 1 Timothy 4:1 reiterates and says people will depart from the faith and give heed to seducing spirits. It’s nothing personal towards CC, I feel this way towards the whole church in general. As I said in my comment (on your last entry) I commend you for your optimism. but I just don’t share it. Not that I’m right and you’re wrong or you’re right and I’m wrong, it just comes down to not everyone has the exact same burden laid upon their heart. You have a burdened heart for CC, and if God wants you to pray for them fervently then by all means do so. 🙂

    In regards to Brian Brodersen, his compromise is not really surprising, considering the following entries by Ephesians 511: http://ephesians511blog.net/?s=brian+brodersen&submit=Search

    John Crowder aside, Welch is in a fairly recent video at some house church praying in that same gibberish sounding tongues that all the NAR does, then he proceeds to say that angels with black feathers surrounded him. Then in another portion of the video he is praying over some guy with all these people surrounding and they are all praying that gibberish “shallala shaba laala” whatever, and the guy spits up a gem. There was an expose by some Catholic guy, exposing “Christian rock” and he talks about Welch’s band Love and Death and evidently Welch had a Muslim in that band…but apparently that band is Christian? Hmmm

    My point? CC has known about Welch for a while, his connections/affiliations are no secret. It isn’t for me to say if Welch was never saved or not, but looking back when his conversion was still fresh (cause I use to be enthralled by his testimony when I was deceived in the NAR) and I read his book, saw the news clips and his I Am Second video etc. he had zero talk about godly sorrow, being convicted of sin, him realizing that he deserved hell, repentance. Then to boot, there is a video of him during the Lakeland revival (circa 2007/2008) of him with Patricia King and Todd Bentely “getting in the spirit”. Ryan Ries ain’t that stupid, he knew Welch’s NAR connections.

    Like I said in my last comment, CC has NAR tendencies dated back to Frisbee and Kuhlamn. Brodersen’s response is really not all that surprising. Sad yes, of course. But these people have shown, little by little here and there, their true colors for years. Its just the days in which we live. 2 Timothy 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived……

    • I am so sorry that you received nasty emails. You were just sharing information.

      In fact,I almost put more about the controversial aspects in my last post. I chose not too, because I didn’t want it to distract from my article. It was off topic.

      But honestly, after hearing the show on Friday, the first thing on my mind was what happened to Nick VanderLaan. Calvary Chapel doesn’t like people who tell the truth about liars that have once in a while ended up in their pulpits.

      And totally, Frisbee and Kuhlman are embarrassing relics to the history of the movement.

      I just have too many loved ones that are on that ship. I gotta fight for them as much as I can.

      I would love to see that video you mention. When you get a chance can you post a link?

      Thank you sister 🙂

  2. earl harris says:

    insane…full of the devil…take the name of christian off this stuff. nuts…boyis there a day fast approaching…

  3. bree says:

    Heartbreaking. But you were obedient in speaking what the holy spirit has put on your heart. Will keep praying. Keep up your warnings coming. The world needs the Lords watchmen.

  4. leanne nixon says:

    Excellent article! Thanks so much for laying it out so well! These are things my husband and I have been feeling and saying for some time…which leads me to tell you that we have lost many Christian friends and a few much-loved family. I know this is not important, but never ignore or discount the cost (and pain) of following Christ alone. There is a large church about a mile from my home. The minister started in a small church with much dedication and love for the Lord. Another ‘wilder’ pastor helped him build a “new and more seeker friendly church”. It’s true that the people came, poured in, actually. It is now one of the biggest churches here…and very different from this mans’ foundation. It has light shows on the ceiling at eve. and mid-week services, multiple activities open to the community. They built a large baseball field, a big playground for kids…ok, but there is no visiting of the sick, no help for the elderly, no programs reaching into the jails, no one sitting beside the homeless. Some days, I avoid driving past and go out of my way to go into the city; there is a coldness and a feel of evil there for sure.

    • We are certainly in the last days, and sadly it this is happening in so many churches. Please continue to meet and pray and fellowship with on-fire believers (even if you only know a couple). And earnestly wait for His glorious appearing ❤ God bless you!!!

  5. Wendy says:

    Thank you for taking the time to write a response to the program. Everything you wrote so confirmed every red flag I had when watching. Weeping with you and mourning the compromise that Calvary Chapel has taken.

    • Thank you Wendy, for commenting on the Pastors Perspective Facebook page and trying to speak truth to them. God bless you!!!

      • Wendy says:

        Well, I did try to go to them personally – Brian Brodersen and the pastors on Calvary Chapel’s Leadership Council. When I was told that the Leadership Council had no authority to do anything and when Brian Brodersen refused to respond, I thought it was time to address them publicly, especially when they publicly decided to say they had no time to listen to any warnings about The Whosoever’s link to evil.

  6. Rita says:

    Thank you so much for being diligent share the truth about what is going on out there. Because of dealing with brain tumor surgeries and a current regrowth and treatment it is difficult to read long pieces like this. But I read what I can absorb. I just wanted to comment to let you know that your efforts are appreciated! It is so sad to see what is being done in the name of Christian these days. So much falsehood.

  7. Wow… obviously there is a lot of spiritual growth needing to take place in some of these cats! If they truly are seeking the Truth found only in a relationship through Jesus Christ they will eventually be made to see the error in their ways… which appear to be many. I know this because God Almighty brought me out of a similar mess!
    Bellying up to the wiles of the devil is not going to nurture Gods Spirit who wants to well up in an individual like a living spring of water and connect them with God the Father, and teach them His ways by the Light of his Word. Hearts must be purposed on Truth and a persons will must be surrendered to Him, who then is able to set captives free! This I have found to be a life long process thus far (I’m 54 yrs. old)… likened to carrying our cross and following Him.
    Some people learn quick because they surrender all immediately and mature faster in the Lord. Others want to hold on and dabble in the world and want to rationalize their sin and wrestle with the Spirit of the Lord, until they are broken like Jacob was, like I was!
    I see no reason not to try and reach these people who attend these satanic events, but a person can easily come in contact with them waiting outside the doors they went in, rather than go in and let the smell of the mire they waller in, get on them too!
    I must say that there are equally as sin ridden venues and styles of music that focus on more subtle tactics that satisfy the flesh! This style of music is just more blatant!
    A a musician myself, I can not even fathom sharing a stage with the kind of filth I just witnessed here, or a stage with women half dressed or other musicians who sing about dirt roads and beer one song and Amazing Grace the next! Nor could I ever come up with a twisted rationalization to do so and not be convicted to my knees unto repentance. But there was a time in my walk with the Lord I would have, until my eyes were opened and my ears were made to hear what the Spirit of the Lord was speaking to my heart that was purposed on truth. I had to mature in my walk with Christ for this to happen.
    That being said I am quickly reminded by Gods Holy Spirit to consider the parable of the wheat and the tares. God is certainly capable of adding and removing these false witnesses, false teachers, and workers of iniquity as he chooses. It is never our job to think we should be uprooting tares, because that will only hurt the wheat around them that the Lord is cultivating!
    I think he has raised watchmen like us to give warning that there is a devil who roams like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour, and that some “ministries” are of that ilk!
    But our mission should be always to point to the Roaring Lion of the Tribe of Judah who is the Lord of All and His name is JESUS! Gods Holy Spirit will give discernment to an individual whose heart is purposed on Truth that they are being seduced by an anti-christ or Pharasitical spirit!
    Amen and Amen – JMM

  8. Tim says:

    Minor point here and a little off topic, but I appreciated your mentioning “Ad Hominem”. I’m a 64yr old college graduate and have never heard that term before. After following the link to Wiki and reading the definition, it sure opened my eyes and filled in a lot of “gaps” about discussions I’ve had with a number of people over the years! 🙂

  9. A non says:

    Thank you Hiker for your diligence and time in Writing these articles.

    It would be so awesome to find out if Hiker was a Calvary Chapel Senior Pastor 🙂

  10. Darren P says:

    Sadly, it is pretty obvious these guys have compromised the one thing in life that cannot be compromised. Sometime back, in the ongoing battle with sin and the flesh that we all face everyday, I thought maybe it would be OK if I listened to Tool-just a little bit. Instantly, I was right back to the same headspace and dare I say, demonic influence, that used to see me meditate and do ceremonial magick as I listened to the music in the background. I instantly knew continuing to listen could only bring the Lord’s consternation and sadness. If Broderson had listened to those brothers be spat on and harassed by the concert’s authorities, he would have realized how ridiculous his sugarcoat of the Whosoevers promoting Knotfest. Watch a little of Knotfest, and tell me that cavorting IN AGREEMENT with these God hating Satanists is a good thing. Of course, when you still revel in your old sin-at least taking pride in it as Ryan does repeatedly (how many times does he talk about banging girls, snorting coke, ??), it is so so perilous to be sleeping with these snakes. But it is even more perilous in the position of teacher, as both Brian and Ryan are now, to teach error to babes in Christ. Another good post Hiker.

  11. Darren P says:

    As a side point, is anybody as disturbed by Head’s demonic eye makeup as I am? It reminds me of a artist and author I used to really like when I was into all the dark things. Look up the artist Brom and check out his portraits of the fallen ones. They all sport that horrid makeup on their eyes. I wonder if his portraits are the inspiration?

    • bree says:

      Its all an appearance of evil. And I find it odd that these men cannot let go of the devil. 1 corinthians 10:21,” ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils; ye cannot be partakers of the Lord’s table, and the table of devils.”

      • deleted says:

        But the Lord said to Samuel, “Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The Lord does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart.”

        • deleted, I know you are trying to use this Scripture to tell Bree that she is making an unfair judgment, because she is looking at the outside. But this verse is not talking about evil appearances. It is about looking at someone who is smaller or weak looking, and dismissing them. Looking at someone’s outer physical appearance, not their fashion and style. No one here is judging people because of what they look like, but based on what is clearly laid out in Scripture as sin!

        • Darren P says:

          I’m sorry deleted, so it is OK to paint your eyes imitating the fallen? So it would be OK to dress in all black, file your teeth to points and write sigils on your skin? Because that is what is next. If the eye is the window to the soul, the way they are painting them, it is pretty obvious who they are trying to show us lies behind their window.

    • Elaine says:

      Hi Darren, yes, it’s bothered me that Welch and his band have the demonic eye look going on. They look like any other heavy metal/death metal band that’s tried to look evil/dark/goth with the black makeup. If you are full of Jesus Christ why is that appealing? The fruit of walking in the spirit does not result in trying to look dark and evil copying the look of satanic bands. I read a comment by Nikki Sixx of Motley Crue some time ago. He couldn’t believe that one of their songs was getting radio play. He asked, “Don’t people pay attention to the lyrics?” They were trying to be as wicked as they could – and no one seemed to notice! No, people are not paying attention. They don’t care. I think they are desensitized to the appearance of evil. It’s just cool now. So you can have someone saying they follow Jesus while they look like they follow the devil, hang out with people who brag about following the devil – and the fans defend it. It’s too sad for words.

      • Darren says:

        True true Elaine! Look at the tour, Prepare for Hell, they are talking about. It is nothing more than Satanic filth. Several brothers went and tried to preach, they were practically assaulted. And then the referenced these courageous men-as being judgers. No Ryan, they were trying to save their would from Satan’s grasp. Broderson is star struck, period.

    • Elaine says:

      Darren, I just saw an article on Good Fight Ministries Facebook page about a Satanist in Tennessee who is serving life for murder and cannibalism. There were two pictures – one of him with the white colored eye contacts and one with the black makeup – it looks just like the make up and contacts the members of Brian Welch’s band Love and Death wear. I immediately thought of them. I think the mixing of the profane with the sacred is another way to dumb us down.

  12. Raymond D. says:

    I was involved in CC for many years. The majority of those years was spent out of CC West Covina/Golden Springs. I now pastor a home fellowship. I have had run ins with CC leadership and addressed issues to Roger Wing. I have long since given whatever they become over to the Lord. Their local pastors attack us as a cult and then spew this garbage out and their congregants eat it up……… sad.

    I have a request, I would like to send people to your site. I am hesitant due to the videos you post in an effort to expose what they are really about. The truth of the matter is that there are many with varying weaknesses and I can’t be accountable for telling someone to visit the site and then having them stumble. I am not sure how you’d handle this, but that is my dilemma.
    Back in the 80’s, Chuck was speaking at West Covina. He spoke of nude paintings and how they were yesteryears erotica. He said, “How could you not be affected by it, unless of course women are not your preference.” His point, avoid all the garbage you can. Now here we are, less than 30 years later and they are encouraging people to delve in. What a mess!

    • What I will do is when I get back to my computer, remove the embedded video for “Flush” (I am sick of seeing it anyway) and just provide a link to the video in the text. So people won’t see the women in the video, as they scroll down the page.

      Thank you for sharing this comment. I am praying for your ministry. God bless you!!!!

  13. Raymond D. says:

    Thank you. I will pass on the website address today.

  14. Anonymous says:

    It kind of makes me sad that at the end of the day, if you are a believer Brian is your brother in the Lord. Not once in your comments, although you say your heart was grieved did you mention that you were praying for him or anyone associated with CC. Although I do not agree with your opinions, I do not disregard them. Yet, I pray that you would pray for your brothers and sisters in the Lord than influence people by your opinion rather than the word of God and prayer.

    • You say, “Not once in your comments, although you say your heart was grieved did you mention that you were praying for him or anyone associated with CC.” But that is not true at all.

      “I was hoping and praying to hear back from him.”

      “I have prayed to the Lord to help me write this. Because first and foremost I need to have a spirit of humility. I am nobody. I am not here to win an argument. Pastor Brian is smarter than I am, and he has accomplished more in his life than I have.”

      “But I am still praying.”

      “I still love the people of Calvary Chapel. Of course. I am fervent in prayer for them to see the truth.”

      “I am praying for everyone who sees this. God bless you.”

      So are you saying that it is just my opinion that people who serve the Lord in ministry at Calvary Chapel should not use bad language while they are ministering? Is it just my opinion that they should promote truth and not false doctrine, and aberrant doctrine? Is it just my opinion that people who serve the Lord in leadership should be separate from the world and holy? Should they not make a clear distinction between what is holy and what is evil? Should they not preach a clear gospel of what the cross means?

      I am sorry, but those are requirements in Scripture for leaders, not my opinion. Read 1 Timothy 3.

    • bree says:

      Brian is not a brother in Christ just because he says he’s christian. He believes a false doctrine of new age and mysticism. He does not walk in the holy spirit. When a person believes and practices a different gospel then the one Christ left us, he is not a righteous follower of Christ. We need to stop assuming everyone is a brother or sister in Christ. The Lord left us many warnings of wolves in sheeps clothing. Remember, test the spirits . Stay prayed up, read up and obediant to Christ. Your faith will be your sight. Thank you Jesus for our helper the holy spirit!

      • Evan says:

        Thank you for your astute observation. Too many in the church accept the claims of people who say they are Christians but don’t follow the Lord. A large factor in this debacle is that churches strategize and give priority to make converts while making disciples is merely left to chance…after all, once save always saved, right? It seems to me that these people believe they love God because they feel, or say that they love God. While I don’t necessarily doubt their emotions or words, love for God is not truly manifested by what we say but rather by what we do. In order to say that we truly love God, one must be obedient and abide in him. Mere words are not a substitute for our actions. To those in the whosoever movement, Jesus said it best:
        WHOEVER has my commands and KEEPS them is the one who LOVES me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them” (Jn 14:21).

  15. Clarisa says:

    I have had similar views at one point. I use to be totally against the Whosoever’s because I too had seen things that weren’t ok. I saw favoritism, politics, gossip, slander, and much much more. I too went on a Whosoever bashing campaign.

    I felt that unless you were in a gang, ex stripper, ex drug addict or had something to offer you were not going to be used. I was a leader in the ministry and saw things in the background that were heartbreaking.

    NOW….The Lord showed me that by my badmouthing Christians or people stating they are believers was only creating judgement on me.( Matthew 7:1) I was convicted that I was stating things on social media against this ministry and CC because deep down inside I knew it was not right. Whether or not I felt that the people serving in the Whosever ministry were correct or using sound doctrine wasn’t something I should have blasted all over the internet. I should have gone further with bringing my issue to the elders. I “felt” I was standing up for those that were not strong enough to stand up for themselves. I see now that it was the enemy. Through my anger and frustrations, I am sure I stumbled many and caused the church to look bad.

    Over time God healed me and revealed so much to me. I was looking to man and not Him. I have talked to Ryan and I have seen with my own eyes a change. I think we as believers need to be very careful in both misrepresenting Christ, like you feel the Whosoever’s are doing and also stirring up strife.

    If this blog was ONLY open to believers (which is almost impossible) then I would say rant on. HOWEVER there are non believers coming on here and really thinking Jesus is a joke or that being a Christian is like being in the world. I appreciate you trying to share truth however GO TO CCGS walk up to Ryan like I did and ask him. He is willing to talk to you.

    I see your view and understand your concerns, but I also see what this ministry has done. I see the fruit and I see lives being changed. Do I think all Calvary’s are living the way Jesus would instruct, probably not, but I have seen some that are.

    Bottom line we need to love hold each other accountable IN LOVE. There are too many people hating on Christians and when it comes down it, none of us will be standing with anyone when we are in front of the Lord when we die. Leave in God’s hand and let the Holy Spirit do His job.

    God Bless

    “But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.” —Galatians 5:22–23

    • Hi Clarisa,

      Thank you for commenting. I read and re-read your comment to make sure that I understand what you are trying to say. I think your situation is a little different from what I am doing though. I have a friend who was employed at a large church. He was very disillusioned when he saw things going on behind the scenes that were terrible and hypocritical. This person chose not to vent publicly because even though the behavior was wrong, it would hurt more people than it would help. It also would be personal. The motive would be wanting to get even and expose fakes. In that instance, I think it is good to not move in the flesh to try to rip apart a ministry.

      This is different. This is not personal. I have no beef or ill will towards The Whosoevers. This isn’t about them upsetting me or hurting my feelings, or being fake or whatever. This is about serious error in the body of Christ. It isn’t personal, it is scriptural. When you get into the area of false teaching, you need to deal severely with it. You have Brian Welch promoting the occult and drunk in the spirit garbage. His false teaching is what you need to be concerned about! Not my little blog! Do you realize how much influence he has over believers and non-believers! Seriously. His Facebook gets more traffic in a day than my blog has ever gotten! So please, if you care about the church, and non-believers than think hard about who is really the dangerous minister.

      It is so crazy to me that no one will hold Brian Welch or Ryan accountable, but they feel very free to tell me that I am doing the devils work. If it wasn’t so crazy, it would be funny! I mean, it almost seems like they could straight up shoot heroin in the pulpit and people would be like, “Well, I can relate to that. Don’t judge!”

      It is like seriously, as long as they don’t open up a blog . . . because obviously that is the real evil in the church. Blogging. LOL.

      Anyways, I am not saying that the Lord wasn’t telling you to keep things to yourself about them. But I have prayed so so much about all of this, and I feel a much different call from Him. I think it is a different situation, and a different motive. Things have gone way too far. People see it, and they need some leadership (which the church is not providing). If this was handled right to begin with, things would not be where they are. As far as me walking up to Ryan, I am not exactly in the situation to do that. But I have tried many times to talk to him and Pastor Brian, and they didn’t ever respond to me.

      Anyways, thanks again for sharing. God bless you.

  16. Jay says:

    I am speechless and so disappointed that Pastor Brian and Pastor’s perspective wouldn’t take this more seriously! I remember about a year ago, or so, a friend off mine, who went to CC Golden springs, and I joked about Ryan Ries’s testimony and how it seemed that rather than him repenting of his past and warning the youth, he relished in it and spoke of it in the way someone would reminisce over the past. I guess maybe he wasn’t warning them but perhaps inticing them with all of his recollections. I may be reading to much into it or judging too harshly, which is not my intent, but with the current information it’s hard not to question what is going on and what they’re preaching!..or not preaching for that matter.

    • I have wondered the same thing. It sometimes seems like he is bragging instead of telling his testimony. Like King Solomon, “I had all the women, all the money, all the fame, all the whatever . . . ” And especially about the women. I overheard someone joking once about how Ryan used to talk about “banging women” in such a proud way it was like “I banged this girl” and then “I banged that girl” and then I met this other girl and “I banged her too.” Not joking. I have literally heard him talk like that (those exact words, please forgive me for quoting him), and I have heard people comment about it, and joke uncomfortably about how inappropriate it is to talk like that. It makes people uncomfortable. There are ways to talk about sexual immorality, addiction, and fornication without polluting our minds and disrespecting our sisters in the Lord!!!

  17. I just wanted to say, “Thank You!” for two very well written posts. I have shared them both on my FB page with some rather lengthy commentary as you have touched on something very near and dear to my heart. I share your heart in grieving over what is happening in CC Chapels and the blindness that Brodersen is exhibiting. To comment would be much to lengthy here so I will just share one small snippet followed by the links to my comments if you desire to read them.

    “They, like many other churches and a LOT of individuals who profess to be Christian have one major problem. They hold to the lie that people can somehow make a difference in another person’s life to save them. The result is the church winds up looking more like the world than Christ and is riddled with sin. It is a lie that if the Church just looks and acts like the world, people will come to Christ. Christ stood in stark contrast to the world.”

    In the two following links I touch on some of the more obvious and even downright dangerous issues you eluded to.

    • Thank you for sharing Royce. You make such a good point. And so many people are supporting the ministry too by saying “Ryan brought me to Christ” or “I came to church because of Head” –and I want to slap my forehead and say “No! It can’t be that!!!! Come for Christ!!!!” They don’t see what they are saying. It is the Gospel, and the power of God that saves us. Regardless of where we are at and who is involved. We must decrease and he must increase.

      I would love to check out your links, but they didn’t show up in your comment. Please try again to post them if you get a chance. God Bless.

      • Tailfeathers says:

        Once again I agree. There is a subtle but significant distinction between leading someone to Christ and them coming to Christ “because” of someone. It is the Holy Spirit that convicts and draws. No one can come to the Father unless He draws them.

        I am not sure why you are not seeing the links. They are showing up on this reply from you when I look just above your reply. The are quite lengthy so I won’t post them again here. Rather, you can find them at https://www.facebook.com/royce.vanblaricome or search Facebook for Royce E. Van Blaricome . My response to your latest is right at the top for today. The previous response is back on November 7th. In it, I chronicle a couple of personal experiences I’ve had with 2 different CC’s. And I could list more but I’m not out to just blast CC as I think you’ll see from the comments in my posts which you will hopefully get to read. God bless…

  18. Just had someone on my FB wall reply with a very good point wrt Welch and his “drunk with love” which is very analogous to the “drunk in spirit” stuff. Such as that witnessed in their “communion service”. She brought out that we are called to be “sober”. Six times in the NT we are told to be sober. From Strong’s: Sober (G3525): 1) to be sober, to be calm and collected in spirit.

  19. Wendy says:

    I think it’s important to add the following. These videos show clearly that Brian ‘Head’ Welch is still involved in evil and that Ryan Ries enjoys participating in these evil Korn/Slipknot concerts, as well. These videos are from just last month.

    This first video is from the Korn/Slipknot Prepare for Hell tour that just came to an end. You will see both Brian Welch & Fieldy playing this song. Look up the lyrics for Good God (warning – evil): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4g12Hj74oA.

    The second video was taken by Ryan Ries at the Prepare for Hell tour and he seems to be enjoying: https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=887963867882329

    So much for the Pastors Perspective program. They either have no idea what they are talking about, or they are being deceptive in how they represent Ryan Ries, The Whosoevers, Brian Welch/Korn.

  20. Louie Flores says:

    Great article, these CC leaders need to get some guts and expose these demonic false teachers before they start pulling more young people away into there occultism.
    I was on the whosoever facebook page today and I saw a lot of folks commenting on people like you and others who are exposing this whosoever movement. It amazes me how blind so many so called CHRISTIANS are, and how very little of the bible they know, and how they will accept just about anything just because they say they are Christians and share a story of there past life.
    A Christian testimony is an amazing thing, but what does it matter if we haven’t really repented from are old ways and lifestyle? What does it matter if are current life style is so similar to the worlds?
    If there isn’t much difference from us and the world then there problem is not much difference at all. Then are gospel message becomes vain and no different than any other reliouges or rehab program out there.
    My heart truly grieves when I see all this stuff on the whosoevers, I pray and get a little angry when I see what there doing. They are straight out fakes and liars. You can come out of a really dark past and not have to be so raw and worldly to get your message out.
    I am an ex gang banger, addicted to crystal meth, messing around with a lot of women, cheating on my wife, was a horrible dad, I did a lot of violent things in my past, But I don’t have to be like the old me to win other gang members and drug addicts to the Lord, God has completely turned my life around, He has transformed me from the inside out, the bible says in 2 Corinthians 5:17 ” therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are past away; behold, all things have become new” KJV.
    These CHRISTIANS that are backing up this whosoever movement need to wake up, they are being deceived, these CHURCHS are allowing a lot demonic and worldly ways into there CHURCHS and then justify themselves by saying how many “decisions” we’re made for Christ.
    The bible clearly says that we are not to be unequally yoked with the world, it’s not that hard to understand. The bible also says that “a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump” basically meaning that when you bring in a little bit of sin or false teaching into your flock, it will eventually spread and get worse if not taken care of biblically, just read 1 corinthians, 2 Corinthians and Galatians, Paul had to rebuke and correct these Christians about the worldly and false teaching they were allowing in there churchs, Jesus did the same thing in the book of revelations chapters 2 and 3.
    I pray these CC leaders will wake up and make a stand against this false movement, shame on pastor Brian brodersons and Raul Ries. My prayers are that God removes the blinders from there eyes. They are blind leaders of the blind, and both will fall in the ditch!!!

  21. Nora says:

    I don’t know if anyone has already asked this (didn’t read the comments), but what would you recommend to a person currently attending a calvary that wants to bring this to the attention of their pastor? I currently go to a small calvary (less than 100 people) that hasn’t changed much since the 70s save the fact that we have a newer pastor (been with us for 5 years). How would you recommend bringing this to the attention of our church leaders? Every time I have passed on some info, it doesn’t seem to have any attention given to it? Our pastor is pretty much a lone wolf and the elders are not very active in the church.

    • I think it is a pastors job to sit with you and hear your concerns. Many of them do not like to do that anymore. Your church being small might work in your favor. Maybe if you can just share with him some information, ask him to pray about it, and then listen to what he thinks. I dont think that we should try to force them to do anything; that is controlling. But if you pray and share that is all you can do. His response will let you know more of his character. I will pray that the Lord gives you wisdom. I am hoping the Lord will raise up a group of concerned church members and pastors who will speak truth and impact this situation for God’s honor. God bless you!

  22. Deb says:

    You said your article wouldn’t make a distance or change anything… It has helped me a lot. I brought this music into my home and listened intimately to it assuming what was being said was what I wanted it to mean. Worse yet I brought this into my home to my children and to my unbelieving husband who I pray for all the time hoping he will one day be saved. I brought this into my home… your article makes a difference and it made a difference to me. Thank you

    • Louis Ybarra says:

      Hello I appreciated your diligence and willingness to write about this. I was too part of this movement and have voiced my opinion on this which I feel fell on deaf ears. I was bothered by the darkness being reflected more than His marvelous light in this movement. I continue to pray for this issue.
      I sent you this pic of sonny from P.O.D. on stage with this kids throwing up the horns! Very disturbing if you ask me. God bless you and keep you!

  23. Anonymous says:

    you wrote”If you attend Calvary Chapel, or love someone who does, please pray about what you are about to read. Ask God to show you what to do with this information. Don’t just read this, and then choose apathy. Calvary Chapels are full of sweet God loving people. Please bring this information to the leaders, the pastors, youth pastors, members, and anyone who will listen. Maybe someone will stand up and be heard.

    I did this at in a biblical manner at calvary; being involved in numerous ministries over the years and even teaching at the local college and having a radio program for 8 years. what do you think the result was?
    They have a low view of discernment and only care about people in cults not as much in winds of doctrine that blow through. Its a put on, something radically changed after the year 2,000.
    The stories I could tell would make your hair stand up.

  24. Lynn says:

    In response to the comment above by “Anonymous” — could you please elaborate on your comment (closing sentence)? I am feeling some need of verification of a similar disappointing response we received years ago by a calvary chapel pastor and elder here in Phoenix. Wonder, would you please share something of what you were referring to in your last statement? It’s getting lonelier and lonelier “outside the gate” here, and one can start to imagine oneself to be in the wrong for the sheer number of those who don’t see and don’t seem to care… Thank you.

  25. Overwhelmed. …….thank You Jesus You died on the cross for my sins and veiled wrongful viewpoints. ….I have been set free….thank God my enemy has been exposed that my flesh would no longer have anywhere to hide…..my opinion.

  26. Anonymous says:

    I heard of this kind taking place back in the 90’s at a calvary c in Honolulu where a group called bloodbath with Steve Mitchell and F. Figueroa played in. Some who were there said there were people giving the el cronnuto in the audience

  27. Lindy says:

    The videos are hard to watch. I clicked on a few seconds of the first video where Brian Welch showed up at a concert. I’m not familiar with who he is — but I really couldn’t tell that there was any Christian performing at this concert — their actions and “fruit” speak otherwise. Is it really necessary to have ALL these videos on your web page? I understand you’re making a point, but is it not polluting your blog in the process?

    Let’s just get back to basics — Jesus said OVER and OVER and OVER — Repent! And Believe! Repent, or you too will perish! After healing someone, he said “Repent”! I’m so sick of the gospel being watered down to the point where people don’t think they have to repent anymore, practically claiming that serious repentance means you’re pursuing a works salvation. Not so. True salvation involves both faith in Jesus Christ, repentance, along with OBEDIENCE to Christ. Those who love God obey him. It’s really pretty simple. I’m just glad I don’t go to a church pastored by Brian Broderson! A lot of these people are deceived by the enemy, need our prayers and need to repent. This is just gross.

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